Kassy Cho on how she built Almost, an Instagram-first media startup for young people in Taiwan
Three years ago, disappointed with the legacy media landscape, Kassy Cho started Almost, an Instagram-first news startup focused on young people. The Taipei-based journalist saw an opportunity to deliver news to both Chinese and English audiences who were left underserved — and ignored — by mainstream media.
In this episode, she spoke to us about the opportunities to serve younger audiences and ways to monetise that.
The transcript
This audio recording was transcribed by OpenAI’s Whisper. These tools can make mistakes, especially when adjusting for and paraphrasing spoken words. Check important information against the actual podcast.
Alan
You know, Kassy, we haven't done this in a while. So we're trying to get our muscle memory back. That's right. Okay. Three, two, one.
Alan
Hey, this is Spice Pink. This is a podcast of quick conversations with people around the global media ecosystem. Everyone from media-started founders to journalists to funders in all the tech data and design folks. I'm Alan.
Rishad
And I'm Rishad. Today we're talking to Kassy Cho. Kassy is the founder of Almost, based in Taiwan. Hey, Kassy.
Kassy
Hi. Thank you so much for having me.
Rishad
So I'm just going to jump right into it. I'm excited that you started out doing audience development at Bloomberg and BuzzFeed News. I'm curious about what user insights you got there that led to Almost.
Kassy
Yeah, sure. So I started as sort of a, I joined BuzzFeed News in London, maybe almost like five or six years or even seven years ago now when I was in London. And I think when I first joined, I was sort of working as a world news reporter and producer. And essentially our team's goal was to experiment with sort of like new formats. And this was around the time that Facebook video was sort of blowing up. And we were trying to figure out how we could use videos to essentially tell news stories. And I think a large part of why we were doing that was because we realized that, you know, audience habits are changing. People are not necessarily consuming news and traditional methods anymore. And so it was around the time that everyone was sort of watching Facebook, videos on Facebook. And so we were thinking about how can we sort of use videos to tell news stories?
How can we reach our audiences in formats that make sense to them?
And that is sort of something that I then continued to do when I started doing the world news account, which is essentially just the instagram.com/atworld. And that was also a time when people started, habits started changing, people started moving onto Instagram. And at the time people were thinking about, you know, Instagram sort of as like this place where you sort of like curate your beautiful lifestyle of like your brunch and your dog and, you know, your holidays. But actually people, young people started to use Instagram for to consume information to understand more about the world. And so for us, it was sort of like, for me, it was sort of like, oh, you know, how can we best serve our audience and meet them where they are? And so that is something that I've really continued sort of with my work, because I want to make sure that, you know, we don't necessarily, you know, create something on like a website, for example, because no one where like nobody is like opening their computers and like typing in, opening the browser and typing in the link to like a newspaper website and then going to, you know, read the news there, because young people are spending time on their phones. They're, you know, watching TikToks, they're scrolling Instagram, they're, you know, watching YouTube, for example, and, you know, sending people things on WhatsApp. And so it's sort of, it's just ensuring that, you know, we're constantly sort of meeting our audience, delivering the news to our audience where they are in formats that sort of make sense to them, which is what we really try to do at almost. Yeah.
Alan
And this was, this was pretty early on, right? You were starting to see some of these changes happen with short videos. I remember this time, this is when Facebook told everyone to go create short videos and then left them on the side. So what is it about Instagram specifically? What is it about that format that allows you to go different places with your audience? You know, what makes it so different from what you were doing previously?
Kassy
Yeah. So I think the cool thing about Instagram is that it sort of combines a lot of the different, I guess it allows you to do different types of storytelling in that, you know, you can really think about not just sort of like text-based stuff with like a few photos inserted in, but like you can do like carousels where you can have like photos and also like text together. But then also now with like the rise of TikTok and sort of like everybody sort of copying like TikTok style videos, you can have, you basically sort of forces you to really, I guess, like condense the story and really like to get to like the core of it and make sure that you can like present it in a very like visually exciting way that will really hook the audience in. And I think what's also nice is that, you know, these platforms, they are, they allow for a sort of community engagement for you to really sort of directly interact with your audience, whether it's through like stickers, you know, or like polls and stuff where you really can sort of hear from your audience in terms of what they like and what they need. And then you can actually directly address that where, you know, for example, on TikTok and even on Instagram now, which is has the same features where someone can reply to, you know, your video with or your post with like a comment and then you can take their comment and you can reply with a video.
So someone could say, for example, you make a video about, I don't know, FGM (female genital mutilation) or something and someone has a question and be like, what is, can you tell us like specifically, like we just did a story about like a girl, three girls who died in Sierra Leone because they underwent FGM. And so if someone were to have a question about, you know, I don't know a local context of that, and they might reply in the comments. And then what we could do is then we can directly, you know, see that and we can make another video about that where we can directly address them and make, you know, and answer their questions.
So I think what's nice is that it's very interactive and also, I guess, like the formats feel really personal because, you know, people are mostly consuming on their phones.
And so when you have stuff like TikTok videos that are hosted or TikTok style videos or reels that are hosted by, you know, people where it feels like it's like a friend talking to you and telling you about something cool that's going on around the world versus like, you know, here's like a nameless sort of organisation that's just like giving you a giant article to read on your computer kind of thing.
Rishad
We're talking about content and we're talking about platforms and formats. What I'm curious about, and I know that Almost is very new, I'm curious about your specific user, not young people in general, but you're the almost the specific, almost user on Instagram or anywhere else. What have you learned about them so far?
Kassy
Sure. So Almost is actually in is bilingual. It's both in because I'm based in Taiwan at the moment. So it's both in English and Chinese. And so the English and Chinese audience is actually very different. So the Chinese account, the audience, we can start with that one because simpler. It's mostly young people based in Taiwan. I think it's like 80% Taiwanese people or people in Taiwan. And then there's like a few from like Hong Kong, China, Malaysia, and so on. It leans sort of younger kind of like millennials to Gen Z. And so what we've sort of found and then I guess in terms of like demographics as well, it's probably quite an even split between men and women. Although I've been pretty clear that for almost we are very much targeting young people, especially young women, because we feel like young women are definitely like very underserved in media. There's like a lack of media that sort of just is creating content and helping to inform them. And on the English side, I would say that the audience is actually very globally split. There's a large chunk of people coming from the US, the UK, India, and then just like, but then it's not like a very big percentage. So it's pretty much like, I think it's like 40% US and then like, I don't know, 20% UK or something like that. It's pretty evenly split all around the world.
But yeah, I would say that like the audience is usually young people who are very interested in like the world. And I would say that they are very passionate about sort of like, you know, social justice, activism, equality and human rights, because those are all sort of topics that we cover. But in general, I wouldn't just say that like it's, it's only a specific subset of people because as we sort of, as I sort of found when I started doing the world account, I first started just sort of doing like softer news stories and like lighthearted content. But then eventually I was like, Oh, I wonder what would happen if I started doing like more politics and people really, really loved it. And so what was really exciting was that the account then started growing really, really quickly. And it became the fastest growing news account on Instagram in 2018. But what was exciting was that it was all young people. And so people would start like DMing and saying like, Oh, we want to see like what's going on in my country, like this event just happened. Can you cover that? And so it's, you know, sort of seeing that like young people are really interested in, you know, complex issues actually, because I think a lot of times people don't realize that and a lot of traditional media tend to think that like, Oh, you know, these issues are too complicated for our young audience, they just want like fun celebrity news, for example.
Alan
Yeah, the interesting thing is, of course, that that Instagram is becoming quite a crowded space for for creators like yourselves, right? Trying to compete for for news and to provide that that knowledge and information. What makes you different though?
Kassy
I think what's different is sort of in in our there's a few things that set us apart, I think in that we are sort of, it depends also if you're talking about the Chinese side or like the English account. But for like the Chinese account, there's we can say pretty certainly that, you know, we in our curation of our stories, we're very, very like globally focused. Whereas I feel like there's definitely like a lack of media that really sort of focus on global news, especially in Chinese, with sort of an interest in sort of like human interest, which I think a lot of times all of our stories are like human stories, because you know, people relate to people and seeing somebody else who's been affected is like a really powerful and like, I guess, accessible way into a topic that you may not necessarily sort of connect with. So I would say we definitely focus, it's like our curation of stories, we also really focus on just sort of making sure that we are representing and like giving a voice to people that are underrepresented and their experiences in their stories.
So we tell a lot of stories from like the Global South, for example, versus just sort of focused on like US news, which I think a lot of times, at least in like the in Western media as well, even the accounts that or like outlets that focus on sort of world news, they also have a really strong sort of, it's very dominant, it's like very Western centric, I would say, in terms of like the topics that they choose, there's always news about what's going on in the US and the, you know, in Europe, which are all very important, but you know, we try to make sure that we definitely like, you know, highlight other places that also have really important things going on that people should also know about.
And I would also say in terms of our formats as well in our delivery, I think we really try to make sure that we're being very authentic to the platforms that we're on. And so that comes down to, you know, how we write our scripts, how we write our headlines, how we cut our videos, how our hosts and reporters deliver the news to others, because we just really want to make sure that, you know, we're looking at how normal people are using, you know, the internet and these platforms and then so that we can, you know, make sure that we are, we feel when they encounter our content, it feels natural to them when they're scrolling, which I think a lot of organizations are realizing the importance of, but sometimes it still feels like they're trying to fit, you know, something that is meant for something else into like, I don't know, a TikTok video or something like that.
Rishad
I'm curious about, curious about whether you're bootstrapped at this point. What is your current revenue model?
Kassy
Yeah, so right now we are, yeah, bootstrapping essentially. So because we basically also run a creative studio for, for almost. So we work with a lot of different clients, mostly nonprofits and NGOs from all around the world, including, you know, Amnesty International, ICRC, the Red Cross, Save the Children, and then sometimes some other media as well in Asia, actually. And so we really focus on helping them to sort of figure out how they can tell their stories and reach young people. So a lot of times they have research reports like Amnesty, for example, that, you know, they would like to be able to share and, you know, get young people to engage with. And so this work is really sort of aligned with the work that we do and the topics that we cover on almost. So right now we sort of run both of these things versus sort of having sort of VC funding at the moment.
Alan
I think that's a great way to start, right? Trying to fulfill a need that's out there. And obviously, you know, the audience has a need for knowledge that you're providing for. And of course, you know, you have these NGOs that are interested in reaching them. So where does this go, say, two years from now? What would that, what would success look like for you two years from now?
Kassy
I think one of the most important things that I want to focus on at least this year and hopefully, hopefully by the end of this year, we'll have a big audience. I think a lot of things is like right now we are sort of starting to grow a bit more, which after working on it for like three years is really nice to see it finally pay off. I would say it would be cool to be able to really, you know, make sure that, you know, we are able to grow our audience on the main channels that we're focused on, which is Instagram and TikTok. But TikTok's been a bit hard because the algorithm changes a lot. But we'll be good if we could reach more followers so that this way we can start experimenting with some other things that we've been thinking about. So for example, we'd love to, we right now have a newsletter on the English side, which goes out every week. And then on Chinese, we have a monthly one. But I think I'd like to, you know, be able to send out a more frequent one on the Chinese account, because I think, you know, newsletter is not something that a lot of people have experimented with in the Chinese space yet. So I'd like to experiment with that. And then eventually I'd like to figure out, you know, I don't know what the answer is, but, you know, I'd like to be able to, once we have an audience to be able to figure out the problem with, you know, well, the issue that a lot of news organizations are facing is like, just like, how do we monetize the news, you know, you know, how do we, I don't know if we want to like move, how do we move beyond like, you know, I guess like subscription models, because nobody wants to pay for, you know, every single outlet. Maybe I'll pay for like one, but that's about it. And I don't know if young people would even want to pay for one.
So I'd love to figure out what that looks like with young people. But obviously we need a big enough audience to be able to test those things out. And then just like trying to, I think Alan and I spoke about this before, just like trying to figure out what the, how to, how to work with platforms, you know, because a lot of times as we sort of saw, like, because I was at Buzzfeed and then Buzzfeed, you know, because Facebook changed the algorithm, it really sort of affected how, you know, Buzzfeed's income and, you know, traffic in general. So how do we figure out something that where, you know, that is more sustainable for not just almost, but all news organizations, because obviously news is so important.
And young people do want the news, but I don't know if like platforms where, you know, that are, you know, subject to sort of, you know, changes to the algorithm that could impact our reach. I don't know what could, what the answer that could, you know, what the future of that looks like, but I would like to figure out, you know, a way forward, because obviously I think news does need to exist, but I don't know if platforms right now is the correct way for us to, you know, to be able to deliver the news to people if we just keep jumping from platform to platform. So I'd love to figure that out, but right now the focus is really just sort of on make growing and then sort of formalizing a lot of aspects of almost, because I think we've just been sort of working on it alongside all our client projects, but now it's starting to be a lot more real where it's like, oh, it's actually like a thing we have to be really serious about it. We can't just think of it as like, oh, we have some time we can sort of just work on this.
Rishad
You know, I'm interested that you're saying that we need to grow and we need to figure out platforms and we need to get more young people. And perhaps the answer is actually to learn that, you know, about your audience a little more and figure out what kinds of young people need, what kinds of news. News is quite generic. Young people, it's a large group of people in the billions. So, you know, you could actually, you know, there could be, I'd love to know more about at some stage, perhaps in two years, about which set of young people in, you know, what platform or what format you're being able to talk to and stuff.
But I'm curious also, you know, at Splice, we asked this a lot, what are your needs as an organisation? You said you have to formalize a lot of things that, you know, where, where, almost is, what are you seeing that you need to be able to get there? And talk to us about, you know, what, break those needs down. Are they branding? Are they marketing? Are they sales? Are they, you know, we need a new website that does this for us. We need an event. We need, you know, a different format, maybe a third format or fourth one. What are you seeing as, as your list of needs?
Kassy
I would say that right now we've really been focused on the content creation side of things. And why I said like formalise a lot of things is because I feel like we really need to sort of build out in terms of our like, sort of business development arm, I would say, in terms of like thinking about how we can diversify our revenue streams, for example, and, you know, be able to ensure that we are business is sustainable.
So I think right now the focus is like, oh, it would be great to have more people on like, I guess, we started with like, you know, someone to project manage all of our projects, including almost and our client projects, you know, project management, business development, marketing.
So, and then sort of looking into other, I guess, funding sources like, you know, funds, you know, those kinds of things. I don't think we're necessarily thinking about, you know, taking VC money at the moment, but we are thinking about how we can ensure that the business becomes sustainable, where we don't have to worry so much about, you know, how next year is going to sort of look at the moment.
Alan
Kassy, this is great. You know, I think you and your team definitely deserve a pat on your backs for taking this as far as you have. You know, it's been three years. You have, you know, you have dreams of trying to make this bigger, but more importantly, you already have revenue coming in. So I think that's a really wonderful way to start. Three years is quite a lot when it comes to the platforms, as you know. Yeah, so we'd love to see where you go with all this. Stay in touch. That's a wrap for this episode of Splice Pink. If you like our conversations with people across the media ecosystem, and one more, please subscribe. Better yet, share this with someone else and get in touch when on SpliceMedia.com. Thank you, Kassy.
Kassy
Thank you.
Rishad
Thanks so much. You too.